So, anyway...

[tencrush]

kateorman made this:



I like to think she made it for me. So...


HE'S SO DEAD. Seriously, see, the thing is, from a dramatic point of view the story has now, after The Dead Line, reached a point where I will be kind of disappointed if Ianto doesn't die in Children of Earth. It really seems to me like somebody's engineering the tale towards something of an inevitable conclusion.

Of course now, because it's suddenly coming across like somebody's actually putting some thought into some sort of story arc in Torchwood, Ianto WON'T die. Because Ianto dying would make dramatic sense. And nobody ACTUALLY puts this much thought into Torchwood.

I keep talking about this inevitable death when really, I think the chances are about 50-50. From a logical point of view, if there really is a series 4, I can't imagine they'd want to kill off Ianto now, given his popularity, if indeed they're aware of his popularity, which I think they are. On the other hand I fear, like I said a few days ago, that Ianto might be that character that's employed in Russell's time-honoured tradition of making supporting characters suffer in order to prove to us that the main characters are awesome enough to be worth suffering for. (Also, those stills from episode 5 showing only Gwen and Rhys involved in what is obviously the dramatic-saving-of-the-children-ending kind of fill me with dread.)

All in all, I'm just not sure. I'm still swinging towards Ianto-death. (Or voluntary retcon, of course, I can't stress that one enough because it totally makes sense, and also because that one leaves a possible S4 open to debate on the subject of bringing Ianto back somehow.)

Comments

[rexluscus.livejournal.com]

My prediction: death for Ianto, Retcon or otherwise quitting Torchwood for Gwen so she can go have a family with Rhys. Thus resetting Torchwood back to just Jack, so they have the option of ending the series there or starting it over with a new supporting cast.

[tigercheetah.livejournal.com]

There's also the question of whether Russel will give Ianto a grand and heroic death or a craptastic wobbie death.

I'm looking forward to episodes 1,2 and 3 with great excitment but dreading the opening credits of episodes 4 and 5.

COE-Ep1 *spoilers*

[radiant-pip.livejournal.com]

Well, if we take what was said in the episode clip shown on that Loose Women show today as a major honking clue, Ianto's going to die like a dog...an ugly dog. Nice. :(

Re: COE-Ep1 *spoilers*

[tencrush]

WHAT WAS SAID???????

I can't bring myself to watch Loose Women.

Re: COE-Ep1 *spoilers*

[radiant-pip.livejournal.com]

Here's the link if you want to chance it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzOsDpd0dbU

The moment is :25 in.

Ianto: You are going to get us killed.
Jack: No, you get killed. Not me. You die like a dog. An ugly dog.

They're joking around, but still...foreshadowing? (I can't see why Jack would be joking around about something like Ianto's death--especially, you know, in their line of work, but whatever. RTD's probably just messing with us...)

Re: COE-Ep1 *spoilers*

[tencrush]

No, he so dead.

Re: COE-Ep1 *spoilers*

[radiant-pip.livejournal.com]

It seems like it. How clever. Ugh.

[venusinchains.livejournal.com]

That manip is adorable! And hilarious! *steals*

"I keep talking about this inevitable death when really, I think the chances are about 50-50."

I think this is where I'm at now, but only because I've convinced myself that Torchwood, as a whole, is as likely to be given the "now he's gone, now he's not" treatment as Ianto is. Because (here follows the wishful thinking wild theory)...

After the Asylum radio play, it was mentioned in a few places that Torchwood will obviously have partial or total control of the rift in the future, add to that the possibility that the ### aliens might be a part of the "everything changes" that Jack's been predicting/dreading, and the sum total might be that Torchwood as we know it will END with S03. So, that eventual S04 that the actors keep hinting at and assuring us of the possibility for? - it might have a completely different premise from the TW we've seen so far, one in which Jack and TW3 aren't flailing after what falls through the rift randomly, but are steering and controlling the flow of the rift.

And I'm probably imagining this because of all the ways something along those lines could allow for a dead or retconned Ianto to be brought back into Jack's TW3. (Denial is a wonderful thing.)

[gogo-didi.livejournal.com]

Hmm, I think he's going to die and Gwen will be left to save the day... I'm not happy about it, I just think that's what's going to happen

[nostalgia-lj.livejournal.com]

like somebody's actually putting some thought into some sort of story arc in Torchwood

That is not possible, which means he will live.

[dune-drd.livejournal.com]

This is SciFi, which is my only consolation. Even if they DO kill him off, it's highly likely that we'll see him again.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Now try to imagine the heart-rending bedside scene from Dead Line with vampire!Ianto.

Could I just add this remark: PEOPLE BEING ATTACKED BY PHONES GIVES ME THE PHUCKING PHEAR. AAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

[dune-drd.livejournal.com]

Knowing the writers, Ianto would probably sparkle.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

I DID MAKE IT FOR YOU

LIKE

A PIE

I reckon the chances of Ianto dying (or otherwise exiting the narrative) are diddly/squat. GDL would be insane to quit and the showrunners would be insane to dump their slashtastic drawcard.

[(Anonymous)]

The showrunners *are* insane. Foreshadowing isn't what makes me think they'll kill him off though. Sheer predictability and the writer's inability to create any kind of tension/shock that doesn't include a major character death does. I don't think these guys know how to end a season without killing someone.

[kateorman.livejournal.com]

Mind you, the only major characters they've ever actually killed are Tosh and Owen. Everyone else has either come back to life or only died metaphorically. Of course, Ianto could do one of the latter.

[(Anonymous)]

I hope they don't kill Ianto off but if they do that they don't bring him back. For death to illustrate 'Torchwood is dangerous' the dead have to stay dead. The amount of people who've come back to life in that show is ridiculous.

[satanassa.livejournal.com]

My speculation is that Ianto will voluntarily end his relationship with Jack and/or leave Torchwood (dramatic goodbye scene!). In this way it would be easier to bring him back if there was another series, provided they wanted to keep his character in it.

[virginhuntress.livejournal.com]

I have given up on speculating on this, b/c honestly, it's driving me crazy. At least we all find out this week!

Dead or Alive

[aviv-b.livejournal.com]

I'm recalling one interview JB did a while back (can't remember if it was print or TV) where he said something along the lines of the 3rd season could be an ending point for the show or it could go on to a new season. Killing off the rest of the team would certainly be an ending point - but it could go on with new players (or resurrected old players).

I can recall in the US when this was a popular season finale device. Not so much for suspense but for keeping character actors off balance during salary negotiations - ask for too much and you get thrown under the proverbial bus. How's this work in the UK?

One final thought and a question: I agree with everything you've said about the writing...lack of plot, lack of character development, lack of continuity between episodes, characters that are said to be one thing, but are really something else, etc. What I don't understand is how Dr. WHO can be so well written in contrast to Torchwood.