I'm curious about this. Why is everyone who hasn't liked RTD's writing as of late considered a "hater?" And why does there seem to be this need to group people who criticize his work as though they are some sort of hive mind with an agenda?
I'm not accusing you, but it seems you're chiming in with someone who has that opinion, and I've been wanting to get a straight answer from someone who is familiar with the idea of discussion without using heaps of logical fallacies to "prove" points.
Many of us more than willingly admit liking his work in the past. I don't think you'd find a person on this blog post or in any DW or TW forum who would not thank RTD for bringing back DW and creating TW. That doesn't absolve him forever from making mistakes, or getting called on them. Some of us, me included, could even care less about Ianto's death. And still others love everything he's done, and appreciate the OTT nature of his recent work. Good for them too.
Isn't it equally possible that different people disliked different things for different reasons, but all like to commune with those who will hear them out and discuss their issues? Isn't that how people come together? Common interest? So, several people who already participated in tencrush's blog, or posted on GB, or wherever happen to come to a similar conclusion about something and want to talk about it. Why not treat these people as individuals and actually talk write responses to posts specifically if you have an issue with what someone says? No one here would fault you for it. I don't think anyone here is that kind of person, and you might find some healthy discussion. Isn't it healthier than assuming people who disagree with you are some sort of Mean Girls out to rob your fun?
It seems so easy to create this idea of a "Fight Club" mentality that sniggers in back rooms and plots to trash RTD because it's "so cool." It's ludicrous. You create these ideas because it's easier than dealing with the idea that lots of individuals might possibly disagree with you independently. The thing is, I'm sure lots of people agree with you too, and liked the episode, or loved CoE. I don't see anyone here going on about people who liked the episode as if they started some cabal to prop up RTD. No one here thinks that those who liked this episode, or CoE, are trying to be "cool" by having that opinion, and starting threads over at GB or on their own blogs to gush and squee with others over Rose's appearance and such. No one is running over to trash their opinions in the most dismissive and shallow way possible.
Isn't it possible that someone who grew up on a TV show might have some feelings about that TV show regardless of who is writing it? Whether it's a daytime soap or a night time sci-fi show. Isn't it possible that someone could be enamored with an actor for their talent - or otherwise - and care when they feel their character was mistreated? Isn't it possible that absolutely none of the issues have to do with proving RTD wrong, or creating a cult of hate around him? You all act like there aren't other factors or people involved in these issues. RTD does not exist in a vacuum. The shows' characters, actors, directors, and other writers also have fans that could care less about RTD and what he does next.
Other writers get criticized, and the critics aren't accused with such hyperbole and defensiveness. I just don't get it. Yes, he's created some beloved characters. The catch is that he's not the only one who went into those creations. There were actors, and costume designers, and directors, and in some cases other writers who some feel may have grasped those creations better than RTD. He also didn't create Doctor Who. Terry Nation did in 1963. There have been many writers, and actors, and costume designers, and directors before now that people have loved and hated. Loving Doctor Who, or the Whoniverse, has nothing to do with RTD. And loving Doctor Who, and good writing, has nothing to do with Ianto fucking Jones.
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I'm not accusing you, but it seems you're chiming in with someone who has that opinion, and I've been wanting to get a straight answer from someone who is familiar with the idea of discussion without using heaps of logical fallacies to "prove" points.
Many of us more than willingly admit liking his work in the past. I don't think you'd find a person on this blog post or in any DW or TW forum who would not thank RTD for bringing back DW and creating TW. That doesn't absolve him forever from making mistakes, or getting called on them. Some of us, me included, could even care less about Ianto's death. And still others love everything he's done, and appreciate the OTT nature of his recent work. Good for them too.
Isn't it equally possible that different people disliked different things for different reasons, but all like to commune with those who will hear them out and discuss their issues? Isn't that how people come together? Common interest? So, several people who already participated in tencrush's blog, or posted on GB, or wherever happen to come to a similar conclusion about something and want to talk about it. Why not treat these people as individuals and actually
talkwrite responses to posts specifically if you have an issue with what someone says? No one here would fault you for it. I don't think anyone here is that kind of person, and you might find some healthy discussion. Isn't it healthier than assuming people who disagree with you are some sort of Mean Girls out to rob your fun?It seems so easy to create this idea of a "Fight Club" mentality that sniggers in back rooms and plots to trash RTD because it's "so cool." It's ludicrous. You create these ideas because it's easier than dealing with the idea that lots of individuals might possibly disagree with you independently. The thing is, I'm sure lots of people agree with you too, and liked the episode, or loved CoE. I don't see anyone here going on about people who liked the episode as if they started some cabal to prop up RTD. No one here thinks that those who liked this episode, or CoE, are trying to be "cool" by having that opinion, and starting threads over at GB or on their own blogs to gush and squee with others over Rose's appearance and such. No one is running over to trash their opinions in the most dismissive and shallow way possible.
Isn't it possible that someone who grew up on a TV show might have some feelings about that TV show regardless of who is writing it? Whether it's a daytime soap or a night time sci-fi show. Isn't it possible that someone could be enamored with an actor for their talent - or otherwise - and care when they feel their character was mistreated? Isn't it possible that absolutely none of the issues have to do with proving RTD wrong, or creating a cult of hate around him? You all act like there aren't other factors or people involved in these issues. RTD does not exist in a vacuum. The shows' characters, actors, directors, and other writers also have fans that could care less about RTD and what he does next.
Other writers get criticized, and the critics aren't accused with such hyperbole and defensiveness. I just don't get it. Yes, he's created some beloved characters. The catch is that he's not the only one who went into those creations. There were actors, and costume designers, and directors, and in some cases other writers who some feel may have grasped those creations better than RTD. He also didn't create Doctor Who. Terry Nation did in 1963. There have been many writers, and actors, and costume designers, and directors before now that people have loved and hated. Loving Doctor Who, or the Whoniverse, has nothing to do with RTD. And loving Doctor Who, and good writing, has nothing to do with Ianto fucking Jones.